HN Theater @HNTheaterMonth

If the quadrotor helicopter gives you the willies, get a whiff of BIGDOG and his cousin LittleDog, which can accomodate rugged or unstable terrain:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUQsRPJ1dYw

⬐ jerf

And what is on BigDog's back? A pack of six of these buggers and support infrastructure for them (larger battery, for instance, or a generator). Localized air surveillance and potentially semiautonomous to boot.

And I mention this because that's just the direct application of these two devices with no (significant) new research necessary.

While the news is flooding with doom and gloom (and with some justification), times are getting interesting real quicklike where few people are looking.

⬐ tel

Anyone with some robotics experience able to explain more about the floating base inverse dynamics control system and what sort of accommodations make it so much more powerful than PD?

⬐ kd5bjo

I don't know too many specifics, but it looks like their PD example was controlling the joint position. That means that if the ground isn't where the robot expects it to be, the leg will still assume the same position and cause the robot to fall over.

The dynamic force control system is, instead of controlling the leg position, controlling the amount of force that the leg is exerting on the ground. This means that the leg may end up in a different position than the walking controller intended, but the overall effect on the main body should be similar to what was expected.

⬐ sjsivak

Is it just me or does that thing look like a headcrab: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/54/Headcrab.jpg

⬐ 83457

Reminded me of the houndeyes from Half-Life, with an extra leg

⬐ joshu

I thought it looked very insectile.

⬐ mooneater

Its been said before, but needs to be repeated every time:

The implications of this line of R&D are horrific.

Removing the risk of say, US soldier casualties, combined with media control, and with "merely" the current level of inhumanity of political leadership, would be a very ugly mix indeed.

So yeah, its hard for me to get excited about the tech in this case.

⬐ CapitalistCartr

We are rushing headlong into robotic automation. Civilian and military uses will abound. The day when hiding our head from technology was a solution is long past. Responsibility is the only option left that doesn't involve war. Our "leaders" will only be as insane as we allow them. People don't get the government they deserve; we get the one we'll tolerate.

⬐ motters

They're only horrific if they're misused. Robots like this will also have plenty of non-military applications - especially in agriculture. Legged locomotion opens up the possibility of cultivating land which was previously inaccessible to conventional farming automation.

It should also be said that there is nothing inevitable about the close association between robotics and the military - it's just an artefact of American culture and the idiosyncratic way in which high tech research gets funded in America.

⬐ po

Perhaps you will change your mind after viewing this horrific weaponized version of BigDog:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptyV1cpE14o

⬐ StrawberryFrog

They're only horrific if they're misused.

Given that this whole line of research is funded by the US military, what do you mean by "misused" ? Wouldn't "used" be more accurate?

⬐ motters

Under "misuse" I would include things like:

Use of robots for the purpose of prosecuting a war crime

Use of robots to carry out an act of terrorism

Indiscriminate use of deadly force by autonomous robots

Use of autonomous robots in a military context without proper supervision (for example, not being able to deactivate them once deployed).

⬐ modeless

Don't worry, we're much farther from that than you might think from this video. This robot can't see where it's going. It requires external cameras watching it from known fixed locations to figure out where it is. Not only that, but the cameras cannot look at a piece of terrain and figure out the 3D structure; the terrain must be mapped out in advance as a 3D mesh, down to the millimeter.

⬐ Todd

Agreed. Computer vision is a steep challenge and will limit autonomy. The derivatives of these types of devices will likely be deployed as drones in the meantime.

⬐ abstractbill

I know I probably should be worried about this kind of technology, but I just can't help it - I see this and I'm excited like a little kid again. I want one of these :)

⬐ melling

Until we devise a system where consumer products, or government grants, drive more research like this, the military war machine is necessary for this type of funding. Most public company's with deep pockets live quarter to quarter. Gotta beat those earnings estimates, by a lot.

⬐ HeyLaughingBoy

I suspect that if you were rescued from a collapsed building by a descendant of this robot, you might possibly change your mind!

⬐ bh23ha

Unlike the A-bomb which is lovely.

Or the decidedly low-tech genocide in Sudan. Or the genocides and crimes against humanity in all the other places.

Bottom line is Homo homini lupus. It's not like the risk of US soldier casualties is that much of deterrent.

Bombs, A-bombs, robots, not that different, the more things change, the more they stay the same.

⬐ rimantas

So existence of A-bomb or low-tech genocide somehow justifies creation of new means to kill people?

⬐ bh23ha

It doesn't justify anything. It just shows that we are already killing people in almost every way imaginable so another new one would not be anything all that new.

⬐ puredemo

Sure. It'll be more transparent at least. And there might even be some due process eventually.

⬐ GrandMasterBirt

This argument is moot.

As long as humanity will want to kill eachother, everything will be used as weapons. Computers are used as weapons (hell would computerized bombs and missiles be possible otherwise?) boats are used to kill people. Airplanes used to kill people. So now robots, why not its the next step. Knowing the US government they will manufature them without any bit of encryption and with a radioshack remote control someone can hijack one of these :P

⬐ seldo

The same tech can also walk into a burning building to locate trapped people without endangering the lives of firemen, crawl through rubble to find survivors after an earthquake, power household robots to assist the disabled, and more. I know the source of funding here is distasteful, but this is a dual-use technology if ever I saw one.

⬐ moultano

The most effective thing to get me off my ass and studying is to see something I should conceivably be able to create, but have no idea where I'd begin.

Can someone link to a good introduction to how the control systems for something like this work?

⬐ ique

You should take in a couple of lectures of the "Introduction to Robotics" class on iTunes U. http://deimos3.apple.com/WebObjects/Core.woa/Feed/itunes.sta...

⬐ sbarre

I want one of these to walk my dog at 6am on Sunday when it's raining.

⬐ derwiki

until your dog falls in love with it ;-)

⬐ sbarre

then maybe I'd have little cyborg dog puppies.. how awesome would that be??

⬐ staunch

Why can't it move 10x or 100x faster? Is speed constrained by computation or something else?

⬐ mad44

That is only a matter of time. Then we will have the "rat thing" from Neil Stephenson's Snow Crash. It was scary to watch the video.

⬐ Deestan

I think the proverb "you have to learn to walk before you can learn to run" applies quite literally here.

⬐ pkulak

I'd think the physics would change dramatically. It's probably a brand new problem to have it work at higher speeds.

⬐ modeless

Pertinent facts from one of their papers: http://www-clmc.usc.edu/publications/K/kalakrishnan-IROS2009...

The robot drives its motors at 400 Hz based on control signals coming in at 100 Hz from an external computer. 100 Hz is probably the limit of the sensing system they're using, which is a motion capture system external to the robot. (Notice the reflective marker balls on top of the robot and also on the terrain.) My guess is that's the limiting factor here, though supporting a higher rate would probably also require faster software, and I have no idea what the limb speed/precision limits of the robot are.

⬐ BoppreH

Very impressive. Sci-fi stuff.

I just found the big stair demo cheap. That "jumping" behavior looked hard-coded (and it was implied by the narrator) and seemed to possibly damage the robot. Still impressive, but a lot less so than the other demonstrations.

⬐ cianestro

So inspiring. Reminds me of the Disney movie "The Brave Little Toaster":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbBEfZ8fK9Y

⬐ nostromo

I like how they end the video with the perspective of what it will look like when you're being chased by one of these guys.

⬐ chaosmachine

Indeed. Imagine an 8 foot tall version coming at you. Tanks of the future?

⬐ DeusExMachina

Immagine they are not controlled by humans. Even more scary.

⬐ melling

Imagine if they could efficiently vacuum your floor and mow your lawn. We're still a long way from robot world domination.

⬐ DeusExMachina

There are already robots for that. Not so fancy, but they somewhat work.

I wasn't speaking about "robot world domination". That implies intelligent machines and this is not. But it looks like this one is pretty efficient in recognizing obstacles, and shapes. Once they can recognize targets, humans just need to deploy them and they will be much more efficient, without the need of human pilots. And they can come in different sizes and shapes.

I find it quite scary, and the DARPA logo at the end of the movie does not help.

⬐ zaphar

DARPA is the reason you are interacting with other people on this website. The logo doesn't automatically mean "to be used for evil".

⬐ nostromo

The "funny" thing is that it's probably easier to make a robot-killer than a robot that will cook me a variety of healthy meals.

⬐ rsheridan6

Yeah, after you have motion down, you would just need to be able to detect a heat signature and shoot at it. I doubt that's very difficult compared to what they've already done.

⬐ wizard_2

Or even better, attack dogs of the future. When I got home last night the first thing my roommate did was show me that video and then remind me of the "rat things" in Snow Crash.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snow_Crash#Rat_Things

⬐ DeusExMachina

Next advancements of this technology:

- running

- jumping

- seek and destroy

⬐ joshu

Definitely. I will add it to my list: http://creepyrobots.tumblr.com/

⬐ Tichy

OMG, is the laundry bot for real? Want!

⬐ thefool

honestly this is just frightening.

⬐ jasonostrander

I personally find unseen UAV's raining missiles down on our heads to be much more terrifying. I'm actually quite excited about this tech. The first thing I thought when I saw this video was one of these things walking on the surface of Mars.

⬐ frederickcook

Agreed re: the UAV comment. Imagine a world where big brother is watching everything you do, and can kill you from the other side of the world with the press of a button, with absolutely no warning, with no way for you to defend yourself, and no way to attempt to explain your actions to someone.

A walking robot is much less terrifying.

The first thing I thought was that countries such as Cambodia could one day exist without landmines.

⬐ WWZJD

Someone's been watching too much BSG...

⬐ None

None

⬐ m0tive

I'd say an ugly robot that stays upright and does the job is better than a nice looking robot on its side...

⬐ iamwil

walk before you can run. run before you can fly.

⬐ Retric

When it comes to robots it's roll, fly, walk, and then run.

⬐ modeless

This is a research platform, not a consumer product! We'll learn to walk first, and then we'll make it look pretty.

⬐ None

None

⬐ vitobcn

I find amazing how difficult it is to successfully perform apparently trivial tasks such as walking.

There's more information about the 'LittleDog' on the Boston Dynamics website: http://www.bostondynamics.com/

I was really impressed 2 years ago by their video of the 'BigDog': http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1czBcnX1Ww (check out t=40s)

⬐ njharman

I find it amazing HN readers believe walking is a trivial task.

⬐ jrp

The key word being "apparently".

⬐ seldo

I don't even think it's that apparent. It takes us 2 years to learn to walk, even with millions upon millions of years of evolution designing us perfectly to do it.

⬐ cma

>even with millions upon millions of years of evolution designing us perfectly to do it.

Birds can walk on two legs in very little time.

⬐ demallien

Yes, but many four-legged animals can walk mere minutes after having been born, and this is a more valid comparison for the task facing a four-legged robot.

⬐ None

None

⬐ pohl

Yes, the way it recovered from that kick is incredible.

And, if you'll forgive me, here's one additional link for anyone who hadn't yet heard of Big Dog. (Unlikely, I know...) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXJZVZFRFJc

⬐ po

If you saw the original Boston Dynamics BigDog Youtube video, should check out the version that researchers here in tokyo have come up with:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5BPrlOVX2o