HN Theater @HNTheaterMonth

Volkswagen is showing it now. They'll release multiple models across multiple brands every year from now on. Here are some upcoming EVs from Volkswagen. Some available now, some available soon, some available in future:

Audi e-Tron: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uHlohyKLlQ

Audi e-Tron GT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvNw15W_EK8

Audi Q4 e-Tron: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiwevzHsCbU

Porsche Taycan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrVkOQojN4Y

Porsche Macan: https://www.theverge.com/2019/2/26/18240862/porsche-macan-el...

VW ID.3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2Tqw9LX3QE

SEAT el-Born: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ShA3l0BHGs

Skoda Vision iV: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-f1g9xl6W_E

VW ID Crozz: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8zbuvzEA5A

VW ID Buzz: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQut6ks3nSY

VW ID Roomzz: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzP6NOGNIWo

⬐ codeulike

Don't get me wrong, if they pull this off I'll be cheering them on.

The ones actually launched (e-tron only I think?) have been disappointing. The e-tron has a huge 90kwh battery and only 205 miles of range. People can make excuses for it but the reality is that is an engineering failure.

All the other MEB models that are supposed to be coming soon - all we've got is jazzy names and concept car mock ups. Yet to see production car, price or specs on any of those.

Perhaps they have some technical advance up their sleeves. But imho the chances are this big new MEB platform is 75% pr puff. There's a good chance that the things their going to actually launch will be on par with the 2016 Nissan Leaf. That's what just happened with BMWs electric Mini.

So let's talk when they announce actual dates, prices and specs. For now I'm skeptical.

⬐ clouddrover

> all we've got is jazzy names and concept car mock ups.

You should actually watch the videos. Does that Taycan look like a mock up to you?

The VW ID.3 is not a jazzy name. They had 20,000 pre-bookings a month ago:

https://www.electrive.com/2019/06/05/vw-marks-20000-pre-orde...

> For now I'm skeptical.

It doesn't matter if you're skeptical or not. Volkswagen is not spending 80 billion euros on EVs for the fun of it:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-volkswagen-electric-insig...

⬐ codeulike

Ok so we know what they Taycan is going to look like. We still don't know the range. They need to beat the Model S on performance and range, though not necessarily price. Otherwise they're going to look like idiots. This is Porsche, after all. Theyre making a big fuss about how fast it can charge. Is that because they know it won't compete on range (like the e-tron)? Let's see in 12 months time.

Ok the ID3 is a reasonable name, But we still don't know what this supposed flagship is going to look like. It's definitely not going to look like the pics they've released so far. But Crozz, Buzz and Roomz seem like pr names rather than actual production car names.

If they really are investing all that money I would expect a lot of delays because they'll need to actually deliver something good rather than a cop out for that amount of cash.

So let's meet back here in 12 months and see how the ID3 pans out.

⬐ clouddrover

> They need to beat the Model S on performance

The Model S overheats when doing a lap at a racetrack. It's not a performance car:

https://insideevs.com/news/323053/tesla-model-s-fails-to-lap...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfZLGIs0H14

> Ok the ID3 is a reasonable name, But we still don't know what this supposed flagship is going to look like

Of course we do. Have a look:

https://insideevs.com/news/359253/production-parts-vw-id3-st...

https://insideevs.com/news/359217/vw-id3-light-camo-rechargi...

https://insideevs.com/news/359140/video-vw-tease-id3-dashboa...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RENix0of9Dw

⬐ codeulike

It's true, the model s is no good on the track. model 3 is better, so let's hope they can beat the 3.

Re: the id3: there's no way it's going to look like the concept car images they have released. Unless I've missed something they are going to reveal the production version in September.

⬐ clouddrover

> model 3 is better, so let's hope they can beat the 3

There's no need to hope. The Porsche Taycan has already done sub 8 minutes at the Nurburgring according to Mark Webber:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ohHEdaRhF1k

What's the Model 3's best Nurburgring time?

> Re: the id3: there's no way it's going to look like the concept car images they have released.

Okay, you're clearly not looking at the links. Here's yet another test drive:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8cHHNPRg-c

⬐ codeulike

I hadn't heard about that Nurburgring lap. That's encouraging. I look forward to hearing the specs when they eventually release them.

I am looking at the links. One of them is about a camouflaged ID3 being spotted a few days ago. Why is it camouflaged? Because the production version has not been revealed yet. Everything shown so far has been prototypes. Admittedly the prototypes have been getting a bit more realistic in styling. I like the look of it. I'm just saying, no specs yet and production version is yet to be unveiled. I hope they can come up with something better than BMW just did. And better than the e-tron they launched earlier this year.

⬐ clouddrover

> no specs yet

Look at the links.

> Number of models is irrelevant when it's a bunch of different versions of a VW Golf

It isn't a bunch of Golfs. It's hatchbacks, crossovers, and buses built on the same modular platform:

http://newsroom.vw.com/vehicles/future-cars/official-the-vw-...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQut6ks3nSY

⬐ pedrocr

You quoted 27 different models. That's not 27 different types of car, it's all those duplications over a few model types. And when they're all in the market we'll all be happy. Until then it's just a promise.

⬐ clouddrover

You might as well say the same thing about the entire car industry. It's a silly perspective.

The MEB platform can be adapted to hatchbacks, sedans, crossovers, vans, and even dune buggies. That's what will give Volkswagen economies of scale Tesla doesn't have.

It isn't just a promise. It's the mass market arm of their EV strategy.

⬐ pedrocr

Debating against things people haven't actually said is not productive. I think having common platforms is an advantage, hence why the Model Y is reportedly heavily based on the 3. That's what all the manufacturers do. I was specifically talking about your claim that number of models was an advantage that VW had. In EVs they currently have almost no models and ship almost no cars. They've announced a platform and somehow to you that's them being ahead of Tesla who is already at a ~400k cars/year rate. I hope VW and all the others get their act together and ship millions of EVs every year. If they end up crushing Tesla that's no problem for me either. But this argument of yours that VW is somehow ahead in EVs without actually selling any significant amount of EVs is just ridiculous. It's just a promise until they ship.

⬐ clouddrover

> I think having common platforms is an advantage

Yes, an Volkswagen advantage has.

> that number of models was an advantage that VW had

It is. Their MEB modular platform allows them to target every segment across multiple brands while maintaining economies of scale in manufacturing. They're good at it:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Group_MLB_platform

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Group_MQB_platform

As I say, better planning and bigger scale.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQut6ks3nSY